M&R Guantlet

Make sure to check the relationship of the main shaft to table bushings, there are a lot of M&R presses on the market lately that have the main bronze bushing worn out with less than 1,000,000 impressions.
Keep in mind that replacing the main shaft bushings requires tearing the entire machine apart (est cost 10 grand or more with labor and transport)

The M&R Diamondback seems like a strange bird, there was another guy who posted that his Diamondback order was at a 9 week leadtime, then it was explained that there were 30 presses ahead of his.
This is where the strange bird gets stranger, logic and math are fun:

30 Diamondbacks at 20 grand each = 600 grand

30 Diamondbacks at 40 grand each = 1.2 mil

If 9 weeks = approx 1 mil
That's only 5.5 mil a year in Dbacks

However if the normal leadtime is 4 to 6 weeks it would suggest that the real number might be more inline with 3 mil a year

The strange math is I gave 150k to " you " Robert Barnes and you stole 80k and I never received my 16 color Printex Prism ll and then you started to sell the Mustang through screenprintgear.com
You are now being sued by M&R and you have the BALL's to try and do math. Leon said you stole 150k from him. Your math doesn't add up!

15 Printex in the usa in about 2+ years and everyone has problem's and the Mustang leaks more hot air than you. So what about M&R again???:cool:

How do you know it's him?

http://hidemyass.com/vpn/

He's a pro and has clearly gone stealth on all of us. It's not like people will be able to tell its him based on his post history and agenda....wait...

I've never heard that this was an ongoing issue on M&R presses of any year, only falcons that were sold around the time of Bergmann's acquisition of Progressive. What do you mean by a lot? You heard about one from a friend of a friend and you then assume it's a whole bunch of them or you know of two and you automatically run with it and say there have been a lot? I'd love to see documentation of this or hell, actual customers of these machines that have the main bronze bushings worn out.

Lost me on the relevance between a second hand gauntlet price and the price of a new diamondback, I thought was ballparking to buy one machine, not valuing a company that's not for sale.

Well we all know M&R builds a good machine, we can read about it on all the industry forums.
What we do know about bronze bushings in this type of application is that if the installation of the press is not level it will certainly cause premature wear. What we also know is if the customer doesn't grease the main shaft regularly then it also certainly causes premature wear.
Now these M&R spokesmen/spokeswomen are probably reading into my previous statements, but the truth is there have been a lot of M&R presses on the market lately that have the main bronze bushing worn out.
Here is an interesting comment to consider, if there has been only one machine with this condition, then you still should educate yourself on how to determine whether the relationship of the main shaft to the table bushings are a problem on a machine that you are looking to buy at any price or any brand.

Well, if you can buy a brand new M&R for approx 20 grand with a warranty and you can finance it for 60 payments, that's what 500 bucks a month.
Even if you paid 5 grand cash for a used Gauntlet, that's 10 months of payment on a new one, surely M&R will sell tons and tons of these Diamondbacks and further drive down the resale value of the Gauntlet.

BTW, when did M&R stop making servo/airhead Gauntlets anyways? Wasn't it early 2000's not late 2000's?

Bad Bushings on a Guantlet! Bull$hit
I have worked on hundreds,not an issue with this press!

Buyers Beware of Robert Barnes. He has changed company names many times over the years to elude the fact that he is not an honest person to purchase equipment from.
Feel free to contact the following posters on this board and ask them about their experience with him as he sold them equipment that wasn't as advertised as well as took money from 2 people and never delivered the equipment.
The proof can be told by these contacts below!

"pushingink"
"inkman996"
"binkspot" (former tech/installer of equipment)

and
Quote:
Originally Posted by Binkspot
Didn't that happen to some poor guy out on the West Coast about a year and a half ago? I remember seeing something about that here.
Leon Monfort
Skiva Grapics
Carlsbad,Ca
(760)802-6315
I talked to Leon yesterday. He is a great guy,pushing 70 years old.
Paid for 2 presses $150,000, Nothing! Leon is a personal friend,and
I dont like it with my friends get hurt. Leon prints 2 million shirts a
month. Leon's next stop! The Govenor's office The State Of South
Carolina. If you need lots of shirts printed fast and well, keep Leon's
name. He is a real Gentleman. By the way he put in NEW M&R's
and loves them! Let's stand up for Leon! Count me In...

winston

The Winston has spoken!

Nothing to see here, keep moving, keep moving

So now it's a problem when the press isn't properly maintained, I see. Thanks for clarifying. I'd be willing to bet a mustang, printex or falcon would have similar problems with the center shaft if improperly installed or not greased regularly enough. Problem is that there aren't enough of them out there with enough impressions or time and lack of maintenance to really know they have issues.

You are wrong, The Winston has spoken!

There is not, nor never ever never was/is a problem, still nothing to see, keep moving.

Now introducing to the stage "Inkman and Jeff Saxby"

Clapping!!!!!

First question.

Can you guys please describe the problems that you have had with your machines?

I was ripped off 80k by Printex and Robert Barnes, My M&R runs flawlessly everyday ALL day. My Printex runs and has problems. My Prism ll was sold by Barnes several times and we never received that press and M&R came to the rescue after I called Rich Hoffman and asked for his help. I will never buy any other brand than M&R PERIOD!!!

This seems like the new way of the industry forums here on digitsmith, no moderation if the majority think you are wrong then you suffer the tyranny of the moderator and his flock.

Something doesn't make sense here, why is it that when M&R reps gets involved with these customers the Printex presses on order never get delivered, could there be something going on beyond the story being told on the internet?

Lets talk about bad busings.

Show us some proof of a gaunlet with a bad bushing well actually show us a pattern of bad bushings on one of the industries most loved press's

Then after you some how prove this insinuation is true lets talk about that Falcon you sold down in GA that had a bad bushing on install and how you refused to help the customer because Workhorse bought your failing company out.

Are you doing an ad for M&R like Brandt? or are you just going to stick to signing court papers on behalf of M&R?

The Winston has already posted that there is nothing to discuss and we all know he designed the Falcon so keep moving, nothing to see.

However, let's do an easy one first, how many 12 color Sportsman have had problems with the shaft/bushing? Then let's do 10 color Sportsman? Then 8 color Sportman? If there are none, then The Winston will tell us to keep walking (again)

Burden of proof is on YOU!

What press haven't you installed that has had problems after the install?

Where is Jeff's press?

Talk about completely ignoring the question lol.

Let's get the paper signing out of the way again.

Yes I signed an affidavit telling the truth to the best of my recollection. Why? Well simple I have no reason to lie nor cover for Robert Barnes and his law suit. I know if I refused I could tho quite unlikely be subpheoned and have to swear to the best of my recollection in a court room.

The affidavit was simple, I stated yes I seen Robert Barnes use a laptop in our business, was it the only one on site, yes it was the only one I seen, tho it does not mean there was not another around but yes I did see Robert sitting at it using it, oh and most importantly yes absolutely yes the said laptop was being used for printex business, how do I know? Well Sara printed invoices right there on the spot for us from the said laptop that Robert Barnes is trying to claim is a personal computer of Sara's.

So Robert where is the proof of a market being flooded with gauntlets and bad bushing?

If the machines in question are and that is a big if it would be due to lack of matainance not poor design or inferior materials. A little grease goes a long way. Must not have been that bad of a design, doesn't the Falcon have the same style bushings and tapered roller bearing as the Gauntlet. I have seen one or two with worn bearings but one had over 6m imprints and I knew nothing about the history of the machines. Seen alot more that were fine. I know of at least one Falcon (RWB era) with ****ed up bearings right out of the box and nothing was done about it. Just saying.

Those falcons had those "death traps" of safety cables... except they cut corners and got it all wrong.

Just wait until the SO cord used to wire the old Falcons starts to crumble, should have used a better cable type. Just saying.

Now that a new M&R Diamondback is servo index and 20 grand it would be tough to pay more than 5 grand to 7 grand for a used 6/8 M&R

The cheaper the new M&R presses get the less resale value they have.

GOT COOKIE SHEETS??? hahah

Again, worn bearing is a moot point. I could easily take the best built machine and wear it out in a week no problem.

Turns out to get a 8 color Playtex all you gotta do is order a 10 color cause some of them heads are simply not going to work.

So true!!

What does that have to do Esther's question about an approxiamate value for a gauntlet? And besides a gauntlet and a diamondback or two very different machines.